Fully Automatic/Burst Fire

[PureSilver]

Hi, I'm very sorry if this has already been answered, but I couldn't find the answer in the past threads, so here goes;

1. Paintball guns are legislated as 'air weapons'.
2. Paintball guns cannot be fully automatic, cannot 'burst' fire, cannot incorporate select fire with modes that support firing of more than one round for every trigger pull.

If those are correct, and I think they are, could someone explain to me why airsoft stores will still sell you (quite happily) fully automatic electric and gas-powered BB guns? Are they treated differently under the law?


:confused:

EDIT: After a bit of a look-see places other than the UKPSF, I see that it's 'frowned upon' to have a fully-auto paintball gun. Why the grey area? What's the applicable Act? And, since airsoft don't fire 'frangible' ammunition, are they using a different loophole?

Oh, and - one further question if it's OK to hijack my own thread; is paintball a defence to owning a Realistic Imitation Firearm under the VCRA? I know for airsoft you have to join a club, be registered etc - is there a similar route for paintball? Or if you want to own a RIF marker, should you register as an airsofter instead?

[Bully]

Is paintball a defence to owning a Realistic Imitation Firearm under the VCRA

Simple answer is NO you could be prosectuted and membership of a club would not be a defence

I see that it's 'frowned upon' to have a fully-auto paintball gun. Why the grey area?

Not a GREY area - as an industry and a responsible sport we have made the decision that fully -auto is not acceptable so is not used.

If those are correct, and I think they are, could someone explain to me why airsoft stores will still sell you (quite happily) fully automatic electric and gas-powered BB guns? Are they treated differently under the law?

Because they fire under 1 Joule (force) they are allowed fully automatic under the air gun laws if it fires below this "force"

Hope this helps

Steve

[PureSilver]

Ah, right, the airsoft thing makes a lot more sense now, and thanks for clearing up the VCRA distinction, too.

However I'm not so sure about the foundations of the general multi-shot ban. I mean, I completely understand the UKPSF's stance; you guys are answerable to the mob when things go wrong, and I understand the issues of safety, insurance and gameplay that are considered. However, I also recognise that you either don't need to have UKPSF accreditation to run a site, or that some accredited sites do allow those rules to be flouted. I mean, I've been on this forum only just over 24 hours and I've already seen at least two references to the effect of "I put it in full-auto" in the player stories section. I can understand why this is the case; the UKPSF doesn't make the guns and cannot regulate E-Grip programming. But that's not the question I'm asking;

Which Act of Parliament is applicable to the multi-shot issue? Because it doesn't seem to be directly illegal (as in, a criminal offence, not a contravention of the UKPSF's rules) to create a fully-automatic marker and, say, fire it your own private land. Is that correct?

[Bully]

On private land you can do what you want (and I am sure you will otherwise you would not have asked) but remember if there are any consequences to your actions you can't rely on UKPSF support.

[I]I completely understand the UKPSF's stance; you guys are answerable to the mob when things go wrong, and I understand the issues of safety, insurance and gameplay that are considered[I]

You answered your own questions with the above line - Self regulation of the sport is clearly better than Government regulation (look at airsoft) We have our house in order and as such have a good relationship with the law makers but it only takes one idiot to start shooting a "Full automatic paintball weapon" in the wrong enviroment and the press jump on it and we will be the next Germany with a threat of a ban.

I notice it is only your second post so what is the ultimate motive behind the question - you are about to start selling imported fully automatic realistic looking markers and want UKPSF approval !!

[PureSilver]

On private land you can do what you want (and I am sure you will otherwise you would not have asked) but remember if there are any consequences to your actions you can't rely on UKPSF support.

You answered your own questions with the above line - Self regulation of the sport is clearly better than Government regulation (look at airsoft) We have our house in order and as such have a good relationship with the law makers but it only takes one idiot to start shooting a "Full automatic paintball weapon" in the wrong enviroment and the press jump on it and we will be the next Germany with a threat of a ban.

I notice it is only your second post so what is the ultimate motive behind the question - you are about to start selling imported fully automatic realistic looking markers and want UKPSF approval !!

Thanks! Sadly I don't yet own a country estate complete with abandoned airfield for scenario shoot-outs, but when I do, I'll make sure to get independent insurance... :)

The ultimate motive was actually one for my own interest(s);
1. I'm a law student and the VCRA is an interesting combination of legislation from an implementation point of view, largely because it's the legal equivalent of a Mortal Kombat combo-move where such disparate activities as paintball, crossbows and football hooligans are all given a right ticking off. I'm interested to hear about Germany, which I always thought had much more liberal weapons laws in general, so research beckons...
2. Although I only paintball rarely (I don't even own a marker!) I was thinking it was time that someone built a really decent mil-sim/scenario mission-based paintball park, with semi-realistic ammo limits, different weapons characteristics, specialist vehicles, an outcome-dependent plot and the like. More an emulation of computer games like Counter-Strike than too-much-like-hard-work-not-enough-stun-grenades real mil-sim. Obviously, a part of that strategy is weapons specialists in squads, and that (and vehicle coaxial mounts) means a machine-gunner...

...You can see the train of thought! Obviously, until I win the lottery and devise a way of making masks suitable for rapid-fire assault, nothing doing. In the mean time, if anyone wants to loan me a disused airfield, a few Land Rovers, a couple of Unimogs, and some CNC machines to make magazine-fed 'future weapons' I wouldn't say no! Thanks again, and I promise not to buy a marker, file down the sear and attack at random ;)

[Bully]

Play some of the execllent scenario events that we have in the UK as they they might go part way to your objectives