View Full Version : Money, Big guns .VS. Experience, practice and skill
Thats what i want to know what you all think is better, a player who starts out with a very basic gun, and builds skill and experience with it, then as gets much better, move up a gun, and im not talking about the jump from inferno to Cocker, basic to tornomaent, um no. I mean Inferno to A-5, then maybe shocker, and so on.
Or a player who starts out with inferno, gets cocker a few months later, and playes with it, relying on the gun rather than the skill of the player him self?
Tell me what you think.
Ex Member of Landminds
Samurai Jack
31-08-2003, 12:02
No marker will turn the average Joe into an Oliver Lang, The only way to improve your game is to practice practice practice. Any marker will only perform as well as the player holding it. However a better quality marker will enhance those skills. If you got an old site inferno that wont put 2 balls on the same barricade you aren’t going to do too well. At the end of the day you get what you pay for, if you took 2 players of equal skill level and gave one a cheap basic marker and the other a top level tourney marker the one with better marker will do better.
When you invest in a better marker you're getting more accuracy, consistency, better ROF, reliability.
Take any tourney look at the two bottom divisions and the biggest difference you'll find is those in the higher of the 2; have working markers at the end of the day.
In my opinion the 2 factors go hand in hand.
how long do you think you should wait before upgrading to torny level marker then, coz i was talking to a guy who had player for 7 years at SWAT big game and he said you shouldnt go that far as a cocker for atleast 2 years because u rely on the gun more than ur self so the basic gun will always make a better player in the end.
Samurai Jack
31-08-2003, 12:20
Your're asking the wrong person I don't wait for anything..:D
And what do you mean you rely on you marker ?
You rely on it to put a ball where you want it too or you rely on it to be able to shoot a huge string when sweet spotting without chopping.
Or is it you rely on it to work when you get to the last game of the day ?
Doesn't everyone ?
what i mean is that its not the gun that wins the game at the end of the day, its the player using it.
If you rely on the power of ur gun over the skill used to use the gun in the first place then your going to lose.
3dgecrusher
31-08-2003, 14:00
Where me and my m8s go paintballing (bassets pole NPF) we've seen on various occasions people bringing in their own markers while we have been using the rental Tippman 98's and to be honest some of them arnt that great. One of that days we were there some guy came in with an Angel a jersey, trousers one of the expensive sets of goggles and he was absolutly rubbish I think he was just some rich kid who could afford to go out and just buy whatever he wants. Theres no point giving someone the best tools if he dont know how to use them, in my opinion.
Whoohoo, finally, someone agree's with me, a work man can have the best tools in the world but he is still a crap workman if he doesnt know how to use them, thanks very much for making my point 3dgecrusher.
mrmajestic
31-08-2003, 14:50
Not to mension when you see someone with the best gun and clothes etc... you make it your mission to kill em!!:p .. or is that just me? :D
3dgecrusher
31-08-2003, 14:51
Well thats my opinion anyway. I dont think you should go to the higher level when you havnt mastered the lower level. Like what has been said yeh it might improve your ability but by getting an expensive marker doesnt mean it comes with a certifictae saying 'With this purcahse you have become a hardened veteran'.
3dgecrusher
31-08-2003, 14:56
Lol I think that people with all the jerseys etc... can increase the intimidation factor to newer players but when you can easily take out someone with an angel when your using a Tippmann 98 you can tell somethings going wrong.
I think that my opinion could be argued a little for tounament paintballing cause your in a samaller space an amature with a Autococker could probably have a increased chance against a veteran with a Tippmann etc... although you definatly do need to have skill over just being a rich kid who can afford the best markers.
fleisher
31-08-2003, 18:46
Originally posted by 3dgecrusher
Well thats my opinion anyway. I dont think you should go to the higher level when you havnt mastered the lower level. Like what has been said yeh it might improve your ability but by getting an expensive marker doesnt mean it comes with a certifictae saying 'With this purcahse you have become a hardened veteran'.
By higher level do you mean tournaments ?,if you do you can pretty much forget a lot of what you've learned in the woods as its very different.And by tourneys I mean ones full of players with expensive markers and often some skill as well.True there are players out there who just buy the most expensive kit because they can ,on the tourney scene most buy top end kit because they have to to stand any chance.
How do you know when to move on ?
Suiter_killer
31-08-2003, 18:57
im really happy doing walk ons and big games.... for now so i want to just become good at what i love first..... and today i played landmindscap and his lovely cocker... with his e-rex cos my inferno suketh ... i wish my a-5 would hurry up.... and our team kicked his ass... my gf shot him ........... and she was on his team lol.... he was quite often one of the first out of the games
Thanks you suiter, thats the truth, big cocker .vs. bone daddy and the daddy won, landmindscap thinks he can be better than all with a bigger and more expensive gun but my point has just been proved, get the skills first landmindscap because you aint going anywhere with no skills and a shinny gun.
3dgecrusher
31-08-2003, 20:22
I think that if your going to do tournys then I presume that you would have a bit of experience beforehand anyway. I dont think many people are gonna start a tournament team when they have never played before. Im not an incredibly experienced player and I havnt got my own kit yet because I just aint got the money, but I think i've played enough to understand wether I should be moving on to higher levels yet. Even if I had loads of money I dont think I would go and splash out on the best markers on the market straight away anyway.
look guys i think you have got this all arse about tit? You are going on about higher and lower level of paintball? HUH? Tournament paintball is hard, yes. Recball is comparitavley easy, yes probably, depends who u are playing against. However they are completely different disaplins? They are in no way the same in my view other that they both come under the generic name paintball...
Also what is this crap about relying on a gun? You can get to a level with the Tippmans and Infernos of this world but why bother? You can advance as a player faster with a cocker. A good example..... I have helped a friend build a brand site. They are running A5's. We had no one booked in yesterday, the 31st, so we did all the work we wanted to do, there were 4 of us so went out and had a few games. The guys i was playing with were by their very nature rec-ballers. Now playing just frustrated me! I could see elbows, battle packs, hoppers, heads etc etc but had no way of hitting these well presented targets without emptying a hopper at them. If i had my impulse 3-5 shots is all it would have taken? I started snap shooting, then thought how futile it actually was. You won't develope many skills with "adequete" markers, you need a consistent and accurate marker to start this.
Finally you seem to have it engrained in your heads that a "cocker" is the holy grail of all markers? Some would argue so, but its all down to preference. They are good, but a cheap stock cocker won't be as good as an A5 that had £2000 spent on it. However you will have to spend less to get a cocker up to a top level than you would on a tippman. Basically someone was going on about the Tippman team in another thread, a) they don't play at a pro level b) I doubt very much that the tippmans they use bare any resembalence to the tippmans you use.
To sum up if you have a great marker you can do things that people with ok ones can't while still being able to do every thing that the guy with the ok marker can. I'm disagreeing that you need to improve your skill level to up your game, but a decent marker is not a hinderence but more of a help. That guy with the angel, fair enough he looks a tit, and many people think yeah i'll get into paintball go and buy the best and use it twice then stick it in a box on top of the wardrobe. If he carried on and spoke to the regular players after a wee while he'd get better and eventually his skill level would exceed yours, and probably mine, simply because his marker will allow him to do thing that requires a level of technological help. This is perceived by you guys as a walking stick holding you up, were as its a weight off your back.
Phil
My cocker is the best marker in the world - ask me why!
Tom
WHY? its not from what i remember? Done more miles than you in the last 6months being shipped to Denmark and back...:p
3dgecrusher
01-09-2003, 13:45
I understand what you are saying. Would you agree in saying that you would be a better player if you mastered lower end markers? And then you can take that skill to the higher tourny markers. Just my opinion.
In all honesty i think you'd be kidding yourself? If you can why bother trying to master the lower level guns? Without meaning to be harsh just sounds like you are trying to justify your purchase of a low level marker? I did this then came to the realisation is just doesn't work that way...
Just cos I feel like showing off, heres the full specs for my cocker:
2k2 Gloss Black Anno Vertical Feed Body, Front block, Back block and ASA from Belsales.
Full Evo Internals (Valve, Valve spring, Hammer, Main spring, Rex Velocity Adjuster)
Black Delrin Bolt + Black Delrin Retaining Pin
Black Anno Beavertail
Halo B in Smoke
Black Gloss 12" Freak Deluxe
Chrome Sledgehammer LP Reg
Black Gloss Belsales Evo 44 RAM + Quick Exhaust Valves
Chrome Black Magic Vertical Reg
Black / Silver Max Flow 45000psi reg + 1.5L bottle
Black Raceframe with Anti Chop Eyes installed
It goes 'Brooooom Brooooooooooooom Brrrrrrrr Dacka Dacka dacka brrrrrrrrooooom'
Tom
3dgecrusher
02-09-2003, 13:32
Well maybe my opinion would change if I had loads of money.
by no means do i have lots of money?? lol infact i am probably the poorest student i know? or at least one of them? i play ball on borrowed money. I got my marker by telling the bank i needed some more books... Lol hapless saps!! Just like using other peoples markers. Like Tom's!! Rips like nothing else when its working. Had probably my best game ever using it at the PA cup... Just so rewarding to see a small target and hit it, without giving it away too early by having to fire half a hopper, and by the time u r even close they have moved back in. You need the accuracy on a tournament field.
3dgecrusher
02-09-2003, 13:48
lol im not saying that your a rich kid or anything im just saying if I had money to actually buy a great marker then maybe my opinion would change on the matter.
go and see your friendly local bank manager like i did :D .
They are a friendly bunch always willing to help.....
And monkeys might fly out of my ass and play the piano!
3dgecrusher
02-09-2003, 13:56
LOL im gonna call you mr benefit Fraud from now on ;)
i'm not on beneift? lol i'm a student we don't get free money any more we get loans. which means we have to pay it back... and not many of those either? So i will pay for my marker eventually!! in about 5 years, or i don't have to at all if i emigrate for 3 years or more? so could go and play ball in the US? lol
Phil? I am getting really fed up of your incorrect use of punctuation? Learn how to use a question mark?! Use this post as a what? !not ?to?! do???!!! guide?!!?!?!??
Tom :P
fleisher
02-09-2003, 18:44
It goes 'Brooooom Brooooooooooooom Brrrrrrrr Dacka Dacka dacka brrrrrrrrooooom'
No it doesn't,thats the opening line to " Walk the dinosuar " by Was not Was.:p
Tom?¿ I'm allowed to use puncuation¿ however i bloody ®well want, further to t¿hat at least i can use proper words rather than t¿hose of an onom¿atapaeic variety brooooooom ¿dacka dacka...... And as a child you should of learnt cars go broom¶ not guns!!! Guns go bang? Or at least they do when someone has messed ¿around with your max flow...¿...
Watch yourself?:cool:
LOL
¥¿
TEX_Cougar
03-09-2003, 07:45
man thats funny stuff?!
hey? this punctuation thing is really catchy?!!
oh and my paintball stuff came through on order?! cool eh!! etc:p
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